The Senator representing Imo West Senatorial District and former governor of Imo State, Owelle Rochas Okorocha, has expressed deep anger over killings in Imo State, accusing the Imo State governor, Hope Uzodimma and his alleged Strike Force of being behind the killings in the state.
Okorocha who spoke with Sunday Sun in Abuja also alleged that the Economic and Financial Crimes Commission (EFCC) is fighting a political war against him going by the commission’s approach towards him.
Among other issues, Okorocha, who declared his intention to vie for the 2023 presidency earlier in the week, said that the situation will not deter him from his vision and maintained that he is prepared to govern the country.
You have declared to run for president. Did you make adequate consultations before arriving at this one?
Consultation with who?
Stakeholders, your people, your family…?
Of course, normally, normally! And I had consultation with members of my family; I spoke to few political friends, informing them that I intend to run for the office of the president. And this is not the first time I am running for that office, I ran for the office three times. The first, under the ANPP (the defunct All Nigeria Peoples Party), the second under the PDP (Peoples Democratic Party) where I came second to President Yar’Adua, and the third, APC (All Progressives Congress). So, this will be the fourth time that I am making an attempt to run for the office of the President, Federal Republic of Nigeria.
Did you consult President Muhammadu Buhari because we have seen others like Asiwaju Bola Ahmed Tinubu, Governor Dave Umahi going to consult him?
I am yet to see President Muhammadu Buhari on the matter. But I will inform him adequately.
Many people believe it is the turn of the South and the South comprises Southeast, South-south and Southwest and other people have signified interest from other zones. Do you have the war chest like Asiwaju Bola Ahmed Tinubu?
What is the war chest?
Financial war chest…
What is that war chest?
Money to match when it comes to that…?
When it comes to that, we will discuss that. When it comes to issue of money, we will discuss it. But somebody at my level will not want to run for president if I am not prepared for it. I am prepared.
What do you think you have to offer Nigeria because Nigerians believe the president after Buhari will have a tough time? So, how will you change the narrative on security and economy?
What I will bring to bear in 2023 will be a vision for a new Nigeria and where things will be done slightly or differently. We are going to sing a new song other than the old style. We must trace the root cause of insecurity. For as long as the youths are engaged and gainfully engaged, insecurity must reduce. When the youths are not engaged and they are jobless, then insecurity must be high. There is correlation between insecurity and poverty. In 2023, under the new Nigeria, the youths will be the pivot upon which our economy will be driven and which will be anchored with technology. So, with that, there will be a lot of jobs for the youths and they will be busy. So, when you engage them; and we have what is called youths must wack. It is a compulsory thing. Not necessarily that you are going to enjoy white collar job, but you must bring your talent out and make use of that, that God gave you to shine which is talent.
How do you assess the almost seven years of the Buhari administration?
President Muhammadu Buhari has done well for what he promised Nigerians. He said he was going to fight corruption, he is fighting corruption. He said he was going to address the issue of agriculture; he is doing that with the rice programme. But that is not to say that we still don’t have problems in Nigeria. We still have a lot and lots of problems to be solved in Nigeria. And where Buhari has done excellently well, we must commend him and where more jobs need to be done, that we have to do. So, I am not such a person that condemns people. But I appreciate what you have done, while you improve on what you have done?
If you were to assess the president on one area he has done well and another area you feel in the next one year and few months he can still do better, what will those areas be?
It all depends. It is relative. First, President Muhammadu Buhari is still in the classroom as he has not finished his exams. So, when he finishes, you can mark him properly because you don’t know his programmes for this year, whether he is going to touch on those areas. Power has improved a bit; the rail programme, he has done well. But the problem of Nigeria, if you ask, I can say, for every one billion naira problem, you have only ten thousand to solve it. We don’t have enough resources to solve the problem of Nigeria, but it requires now a person with business acumen like me, who can create water out of nothing. Create a middle class, raise funds for Nigeria and there will be jobs everywhere, factories will start working and everything.
A section of Nigerians believed the APC deceived them in 2015 and President Buhari got re-elected in 2019. Are you sure Nigerians will trust APC again in 2023?
You know the problem we have in this country is that most of the time, we try to stigmatise people on the party they come from or where they come from. Does APC govern? APC does not govern. It takes a person in APC to govern. Party is just a platform. So, when people come with that and campaign, it looks cheap – that APC has failed, PDP has failed. If anyone has failed, if any governor has failed, hold the governor responsible. If the president has failed, hold the president responsible. If the chairman has failed, hold the chairman responsible. Not the party, party is only a platform. There are governors in APC who are doing very well and there are governors in PDP who are doing very well. There are some governors in APC who are not doing well and some in PDP who are not doing well. So, it is not about party, it is about individuals in the party.
Your eye has been on this job for a very long time and you later deviated to govern Imo and now, you are back to contest for presidency. If you have any other office to run for, will you abandon this project again?
I don’t have any other office. I have been a governor, I am now a senator, what is left for me now is just going to run for the office of the President of the Federal Republic of Nigeria. And that is what I think. It is about vision. People think I have ambition. I don’t have ambition really. I have just vision and that is the vision that is driving me crazy to see how I can transform this whole nation to be one of the great nations of mankind. I think I have the capacity and I think I will do it. That is what is just bringing me to this because when you people talk about this ambition, it looks like there is something in there for the person who is occupying that office. I am in this thing for the glory of the job and not for the profit of the job. So, that is what makes the difference. People who have ambition are different from people who have vision.
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We are going to change ohashierism to replace what we have currently as ofushierism. Ohashierism from Rochas’ English is bottom top approach rather than top bottom approach. What we practise today is top bottom approach and that is why the goodies of government do not get down to the grassroots. Before it gets to state level and local government level, it has gone comatose. So, this time, the people, the owner of the power, will be energised to defend our economy, what is called decentralization.
On zoning, you are neither here nor there. Sometimes, you say okay, you are for free election, wherever it falls, it doesn’t matter. At other times, you say the Southeast. Where do you stand on zoning in 2023?
I said I am for justice. You know the word zoning may be misplaced with the word justice. I think what the Igbo are asking for is justice, not zoning. They are asking for justice, not rotation. They are asking for justice that this nation was built upon a tripod – the Igbo, Yoruba and Hausa. The other tribes have taken. Even other people have also taken who are not within that tripod arrangement. Then, when it comes to your time, you say let justice be done. What is good for A is good for B and is good for C. When you talk about zoning, you zone the power to us. Power is not given, power is taken. That is why people get confused about the whole thing. And if you talk about zoning, they will say well, democracy is about the number. But my argument here is that you have to have a nation before you have democracy. If you don’t have the people together, how can you even have democracy? So, justice requires that this time around, the Southeast should be given the same opportunity like when Obasanjo and Olu Falae did it and when Buhari and Atiku did it.
Do you think the Southeast has done enough consultation across board to get the buy-in of other regional leaders?
It doesn’t take the Southeast. It takes an individual who is interested. The Southeast cannot come and call you to come and contest. You have to show that you have the capacity, you have the vision and you have what it takes before you get the backing of your people. Now that we are all declaring, it is then that the Southeast will now look at who they can now support to claim this presidency and then, reach out to other ethnic groups and states, asking for their support because power cannot be given to you, you have to take power.
This issue with the EFCC, do you see it as a witch-hunt and the fact that it even coincided with the day you declared?
It sounds political. There is no reason for the EFCC to take me to court. There is no reason whatsoever. There has not been any investigation carried out on me to take me to court. I think they hurriedly put something together just to get me embarrassed because in the first place, the EFCC prejudged me and said I stole N5.7 billion, which took me to court for my fundamental human right. And on the basis of that, the court ordered that the EFCC should not harass me, that I am prejudged. They didn’t say any other agency, but the EFCC in particular should not harass me or arrest me or persecute me or do anything. That was the judgment I had. This judgment is still standing. It has not been appealed against, neither removed. All I heard again is that the EFCC is taking me to court. So, you can see it is very, very political. But the coincidence is too clear. I am sure that it was meant to rubbish my image for what I want to pursue. But let me tell them, I am not pursuing this for Rochas Okorocha. I am pursuing it for the interest of the masses, the poor and majority of this country and whoever that is fighting this project, is fighting the interest of the ordinary man on the street.
With this, will you have the right frame of mind to pursue your ambition?
My right frame of mind is very much intact and I am sound about what I want to do. The only thing I believe is that justice will be done at the end of the day and I am saying that the EFCC should not be intimidating judges because I got the first judgment against them and they asked the judge to recuse himself, that is, resign from the case. I got the second judgment against them and they asked the judge to recuse himself. So, it means that it is only when they get a judge who can give them judgment before the judge can stay. This is not justice. Why can’t you accept a judge’s judgment? And if it is not right, you have Appeal and the Supreme Court. You don’t want to follow that process, you want to force them to excuse themselves or they change whatever order that they have made. So, this is one of the things that make it look very, very political. If it is free and fair, nobody will bother.
Your life is full of many controversies. For example, your implementation of the master plan of Owerri which led to the destruction of many houses and infrastructure and the Ekeukwu Owerri which led to outcry by residents. Do you have any regrets about this?
No regret.
At all?
No regret. I will do it again and again and again because it is good for the people. The Ekeukwu problem is still a problem. It is a problem because we have a law in Imo State that no market can be built within five kilometres from the Government House. This is a worst criminal activity. People are being killed daily, people are being murdered daily, but I said let’s relocate the market. I didn’t do it without providing an alternative. I built a ten thousand market bigger than Ekeukwu where I said they should move in. And that is barely four kilometres or three kilometres from where Ekeukwu is. But leave Ekeukwu so that dehumanising will stop, insecurity will stop around the city centre. And I built a hospital there, a six-floor hospital which the governor of Imo State destroyed to bring back the market, about one thousand-bed hospital which again sounds very, very, very unprofessional.
You have been having a running battle with your brother governor. Coming from the same senatorial zone, one would have thought you would have run a seamless administration. Why are the two of you fighting every day?
I have never fought. That is a wrong statement. I never fought Hope Uzodimma. I never fought the governor of Imo State. Rather, he is the one fighting, he is the one hating and he is the one envious. I think there is so much of hate in his mind and envy against me. But I have never fought. What am I fighting for? I am not running for governor, so where does my interest and his interest clash? I am not running for Senate again, I am not running for anything in Imo State. So, maybe unless he wants to run for president; that is the only way I can say that our interest can clash. But if he is not, there is nothing.
In your earlier interview with us, you said you realised that it was just envy. Between then and now, have you discovered any other thing behind your problems with him?
One thing I suspect. I think the governor is being used by some politicians who see my coming out as a threat and they are trying to make sure that he drags me down so that I do not run for the office of the President of the Federal Republic of Nigeria. That is the only closest answer I can give to the whole thing. And he is bent on doing so and he has become very violent about it, ordering the shooting of my son-in-law who was hospitalised in the United States for six months; and went to church to abduct Uche Nwosu and pushing down my wife and harassing my family and then, later for us to discover now that the police that did that were police from the Government House. And the Police and the Inspector General of Police have all confirmed that the police were from the Government House and they were at the instance of the governor. And the CSO of the governor was arrested and brought to Abuja here. What about the case? We don’t know. But we are waiting for the police to make a categorical statement. Last time, it showed that the report has been sent to the Villa and I hope the report comes back as quickly as possible.
Why is it difficult to settle all these issues?
It is not difficult. We have to start from somewhere. It is not difficult. If I see Hope Uzodimma and there is a way to make peace, I am going to make peace. I don’t lack anything. Last time, at my birthday, I said let peace reign. I called him for peace. But when somebody hates you passionately, it is a very difficult thing to do. I think there is something I don’t know that really makes it difficult for him to preach peace. And that is affecting him a whole lot. Rather than spending energy on building the state, he is spending more energy and resources in fighting Rochas.
Imo has been in turmoil as a result of unknown gunmen, resulting to incessant killing. How do you feel about this?
Very bad that the Imo State I ran for eight years, peaceful Imo State has been turned to a war zone. It is unfortunate and that is to tell you that when a wrong person is holding an office, things don’t go well in that area. That is exactly what is happening and it is unfortunate.
But the government has been persistent in saying that politicians are instigating the crisis. How do you also feel about this?
But you should ask them. Last time, the governor said he was going to mention the names. Did he mention the names again? And shortly after that, we found out that it was the Strike Force of the governor under his CSO from the government house that was causing all these mayhem. That was our discovery because these people have an outfit comprising civilians, most of them are not from Imo State, whom the CSO to the governor heads. And this is where they commit all their atrocities. Remember I asked the governor a question, who killed Gulak? Who is responsible for those 140 dead bodies lying at the FMC? Who beheaded those traditional rulers? Who are the killers? Tell me. He has what is called Hopism Strike Force which is headed by his CSO, one Shaba, and that is the one that went to abduct Uche. If not for God’s protection, Uche would have been killed and would have been gone like Gulak did. So, we have traced the source of things. It is not hidden anymore. It is the government that is insecurity in the state.
Are you still free to move about in the state?
I just came back from Imo State; I just came back from Imo State. I spent two, three weeks in Imo State.
So, no personal threat to your life?
There couldn’t have been; there couldn’t have been. Why should there be personal threat to my life? For what? It is my state and we cannot run away from our state. It is our state. We have to stay there and sort things out.